Brainstorm ways to turn down men without getting

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Postby wendy » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:24 am

WAC wrote:Can we talk about how to hold people accountable while respecting the privacy of the victim? There have been multiple allusions over the past few weeks about the need to hold people accountable and people on this board engaging in harassment or abuse, but they haven't been named and there are reasons for that. A lot of people here know things that were told to them in confidence with the expectation that they would keep it to themselves and not try to like "solve" anything or confront the abuser directly. Is there anything that should be done beyond listening to and trusting the person telling you?


Catullus wrote:There is a callout thread in the private board.

I don't think people would feel safe doing so in the open.

I don't think you all get the extent to which we feel vulnerable online and in person all the time.

Like, my situation was public enough and etc but there is no where in the entire world, online or in person, that I feel truly safe.

Been kicking off a depressive streak and I'm sort of done.

this is actually something wac and i and a couple others have discussed extensively recently

he/the others understand the vulnerability and other reasons why a victim/target wouldn't want to come forward, and we understand why they need to be able to share their experiences in confidence without fearing repercussions from the abuser, but we're struggling with the fact that having that knowledge makes us complicit (and not in a "fuck, now we're complicit, sucks for us!" kind of way but in a "this is a cycle that needs to be broken" kind of way)

so i mean basically we all agree the best/right/most respectful thing to do is to defer to the victim/target because their secrets are not ours to tell, but i think wac is asking if there's more that can be done than just being supportive and believing people when they come forward and having their backs

and this is actually a question that i have been having a really rough time with lately

edited to add: this is also a question i have as a person that, in the past, has been abused/assaulted/etc, and to me, during those times of abuse/etc, the absolute most important thing was keeping that secret contained as well and for as long as possible

edit edit: i say contained because there's almost always at least a handful of people who are, to some degree, aware of the abuse
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Postby wendy » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:26 am

oh a lot happened between the time i started typing that post and hit submit
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:29 am

I felt like this was a place I could vent and then I'm not venting correctly and like ???

Idk

my intention is not to make you feel bad that you don't identify with my sentiment except you just did say you identified? I really don't understand precisely what is going on tbh
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:30 am

I don't know how we call it out in board. I don't know man. This is a shit time and a lot of things are coming together at once.
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Postby wendy » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:35 am

Catullus wrote:This is a shit time and a lot of things are coming together at once.

i feel the same way

the last several weeks in particular have made me feel very unsafe around the men i know and love and trust despite nothing happening within our friend group

it's just i'm realizing the extent of it and fuck man it's a lot to handle

like i legitimately think i felt better when i could pretend i was in the minority and also that i was, in whatever small way, responsible for the things that happened

that at least gave me a feeling of power or control

and now it's just

i mean i don't even know

i feel paralyzed
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:35 am

it wasn't about what I relate to or not, it's simply the use of "we" instead of "I" which I am totally not used to and for whatever reason do not respond to well, no matter if I relate or not.
eh. now I don't even make sense to myself any more. forget it, I have not only no idea what is going on, I don't even have a mild idea what is going on in my own head from one minute to the next.

tbh speaking of "calling it out" or having a broader discussion on this board, can someone tell me if this line is funny or okay for anyone? I just need a reality check of just how much I am losing it.

[members thread, post there, apparently referring to the lyrics "Rape me, castrate me, make me gay"]:
[love ariel pink
don't care who he rapes, castrates or makes gay


like if we brainstorm ways how to air and discuss and share on this board - I can't take this. So I guess I should be able to?
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:37 am

Nah that shit aint cool thats why we moved it to the members board
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:38 am

Or it was moved I didnt do anything
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:42 am

I don't feel safe at work. I don't really know or trust anyone here enough, and I'm very bothered by the attention I get from boys. I have no where to go to vent or cry, no valve.
I don't feel safe walking around in public. Even innocuous interactions turn into harassment or are fraught.
I don't feel safe with friends. Someone I was looking forward to seeing and had considered a good pal basically harassed me in a public space.
I don't have the close friends here I can vent to except my husband and I know that probably makes him feel like shit that I don't think that's enough.
I don't feel safe online. I'm always waiting for the other shoe to drop. Every time I think the worst has happened there has been worse so I don't know.

So just in general I'm like...the fuck man.

The fuck
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:44 am

x
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Postby snitch » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:54 am

wendy wrote:
Catullus wrote:This is a shit time and a lot of things are coming together at once.


the last several weeks in particular have made me feel very unsafe around the men i know and love and trust despite nothing happening within our friend group

it's just i'm realizing the extent of it and fuck man it's a lot to handle


yeah basically. i've felt in a daze and i can't think properly or about anything else. i had dinner with my dad last night and as hard as i tried not to, all i could think was "what have you done? is there anything you've done?" but it's also like that with every male friend/family member/coworker i interact with and i can't take it and i'm probably going to break down soon.

wendy wrote:i feel paralyzed

yeah
all day breakfast wrote:somehow i always come in here meaning to ask about socks and leave thinking about existence

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Postby snitch » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:00 am

Catullus wrote:What does 'too paranoid' mean?

But like, when someone is assaulted then it's 'well what did they expect taking a short cut at night!'

the last time i took a shortcut while walking a group of guys started following me and the two girlfriends i was with

and this was right after leaving a bar where a guy cut me off from them and made me kiss him

cool night
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Postby snitch » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:09 am

mercenaries of slime wrote:love to exist to make people feel at ease to the detriment of myself

my life

p much every day i say i'm not going to do this anymore but
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:11 am

snitch wrote:
mercenaries of slime wrote:love to exist to make people feel at ease to the detriment of myself

my life

p much every day i say i'm not going to do this anymore but


yeah it me
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Postby wendy » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:15 am

haha what if the women on this forum all had mental breakdowns in the same week

wonder if that would mean anything
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:20 am

lol many board women having a collective crisis.

Lets make this the thread where we talk about our collective mental break downs
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Postby rask » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:21 am

I've had at least three men fall asleep on me on the subway this week

really don't care if it's unintentional. fuck you, dudes!!!!!
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:23 am

.
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Postby Rainbow Battle Kid » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:25 am

snitch wrote:
wendy wrote:
Catullus wrote:This is a shit time and a lot of things are coming together at once.


the last several weeks in particular have made me feel very unsafe around the men i know and love and trust despite nothing happening within our friend group

it's just i'm realizing the extent of it and fuck man it's a lot to handle


yeah basically. i've felt in a daze and i can't think properly or about anything else. i had dinner with my dad last night and as hard as i tried not to, all i could think was "what have you done? is there anything you've done?" but it's also like that with every male friend/family member/coworker i interact with and i can't take it and i'm probably going to break down soon.

wendy wrote:i feel paralyzed

yeah


if this is out of line or not a good place, lmk and i'll delete it, but as a guy like, in general and especially right now when a lot of this stuff is being particularly highlighted, what can i be doing in general social situations to help this? obviously it's symptomatic of larger issues so it's not THE problem, but at least in those situations is there any way i can mitigate my effect here? i do try to like, be mindful of my position relative to women when walking down the street if it's not crowded or whatever, but that's the only real time i'm like, AWARE of how my presence might come off/put someone in a position of unease.
Much Honoured Lord Nefarious wrote:rainbow battle kid you can kindly get the FUCK out of this thread while the adults have actual STAR WARS discussions.
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Postby manvstrees » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:28 am

just don't stand for it when you see people acting inappropriately and don't be one of these people yourself
it's very easy
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:30 am

I guess it's like...the main thing to do is be aware. Don't be upset when someone reacts in a way you don't think is reasonable. You don't know what experiences that person might have had. Try not to follow behind someone or go to close. Try not to approach strangers unless it's needed. Just know that if someone reacts with fear its no personal reflection on you.
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Postby Rainbow Battle Kid » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:32 am

manvstrees wrote:just don't stand for it when you see people acting inappropriately and don't be one of these people yourself
it's very easy


that doesn't seem to be happening in the situations snitch is describing though? like they seemed to be talking more generally like, in everyday mundane interactions, including with their dad. maybe i am misreading
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Postby Rainbow Battle Kid » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:35 am

Catullus wrote:I guess it's like...the main thing to do is be aware. Don't be upset when someone reacts in a way you don't think is reasonable. You don't know what experiences that person might have had. Try not to follow behind someone or go to close. Try not to approach strangers unless it's needed. Just know that if someone reacts with fear its no personal reflection on you.


yeah i'm definitely familiar with that concept. my wife and i have had a bunch of conversations about this actually the other way wrt my abuse as a child and like, "body autonomy" or whatever. where like, it's hard to explain that it's not a reflection on the person if they innocuously trigger something or whatever.

but yeah i guess i just meant like, so we're throwing a hallwoeen party next weekend. i guess i read snitch's post and feel for like, i don't want to just be talking to a friend there and for them to feel unsafe/unsure about me and don't know what to do to mtiigate that other than completely removing myself from the situation or whatever. i dunno. didn't mean to totally derail here.
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:38 am

I don't really know what to do when it's people you trust. I know I froze and was unsure and really uncomfortable and idk are you asking how to tell if you're being problematic yourself? Idk. Just try not to be, and if you see someone freezing up maybe ask?

I guess I should explain what the recent situation in my case was. I saw a friend I hadn't seen in a while because I moved 3k miles away. After he said hello and gave me a hug he kept his arm around me too long and said "You look really really good" and gave me a wink. He was probably not INTENDING it to be super creepy, but like...yeah. It was not something that he even thought about other than complimenting me. But it made me uncomfortable. It made me sad that it was from someone I thought I could trust.
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Postby manvstrees » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:41 am

that's pretty gross though to be real
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Postby Catullus » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:44 am

I avoided him the rest of the tournament. Huge fucking bummer.
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Postby rask » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:53 am

I'm going through the wondering what you've done/what could you do/uncomfortable around male friends/coworkers/family members thing as well even though they may not necessarily actually be doing anything to make me uncomfortable in the moment

I guess the best suggestion I'd have for the men in my life is examine the company you keep and how that may reflect on you and maybe you should hold them accountable or something if they fuckin suck and you wanna keep up the relationship to put it fairly ineloquently
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Postby DRAGONS 666 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:58 am

like dont view my posts as speaking for the whole of x i dont want my fuckin personality to be defined by my fuckin desire for me and others to exist in fuckin safety
remember to please don't feed the trolls ;)
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Postby DRAGONS 666 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:00 pm

im an actual person here with love n dreams!!!!!!! i think the most haunting thing i had was my friend complaining about pals being friends with her rapist and i posted 'hahahaha love how i need to not go nuclear on this shit so i can walk around on eggshells and maintain social circles so the only time i can express my true feelings is through this 'irony' shitposting' and it got like 200 likes
remember to please don't feed the trolls ;)
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Postby DRAGONS 666 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:04 pm

instead of getting confused and angry ppl seem like they are speaking on behalf of x as a whole u should do some reflecting on why so many share a similar experience and get angry at the thing that caused it instead of bein let me into ur clubhouse. i dont wanna be in this clubhouse.
remember to please don't feed the trolls ;)
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